For Part One, Part Two, Part Four, or Part Five, click on the appropriate link.
We continue with President Kimball’s talk, Voices of the Past, of the Present, of the Future from the April 1971 General Conference. This one was full of culture quotes.
Early on, not all the apostles make quotes accessible to find again. Perhaps they thought no one would ever try.
They thought wrong. It gets better as time goes on.😊
The Quote
“Other religious leaders are saying: “… precise rules of Christian conduct should not necessarily apply to problems of sexuality.” (London—British Council of Churches.)”
There are times like this where I wish I was a librarian – I struck out on finding a source of this one, but the quote itself illustrates again one of the voices that come out of other religions where there is conflict between what they recommend and what the gospel teaches.
Another quote he offered up was quoted, but with no idea of where it came from.
“Only this month the press quoted the retired head of a populous church proposing “revival of old-style betrothals which would permit young unmarried couples to sleep together with the church’s blessing,” and “it would not be regarded in the moral sense as fornication.””
Two quotes on sexuality, and no idea where they came from.
He gave the date – April of 1971. Couldn’t find it, but I did find another document that proposed something similar. The source was either Anglican or Catholic - I couldn't really tell - but they thought that a betrothal ceremony before marriage would be enough to let a couple have sex before marriage, and their faith tradition would allow it.
It was an interesting idea – getting married without getting married so I can have sex and have church approval – only the betrothal ceremony kind of resembled a marriage ceremony, so…
I can tell you right now - that would never fly in my faith. Nope. We get married – sealed being the actual term for it. Not getting married remains a sin of fornication and needs repenting from.
Newsweek 1967 and Others – Some Dead Ends
He mentioned another couple of quotes regarding sexuality, specifically regarding LGBTQ people at the time. One quote was from Jenkins Lloyd Jones, the Unitarian Universalist who I’ve talked of in a previous blog.
“And now, the voice of a commentator: “Recently, the screen industry solemnly announced that henceforth perversion and homosexuality would no longer be barred from the screen. … We are drowning our youngsters in violence, cynicism and sadism piped into the living room. …” (Jenkins Lloyd Jones.)
Dark indeed.
Remember, the words ‘perversion’ and ‘homosexuality’ had a different connotation at the time. Yes, they come across as offensive today, but we’re talking about a different cultural landscape back then.
From there, there was a quote from Newsweek Magazine, published in 1967. I couldn’t find the original magazine – Newsweek’s Vault wasn’t nearly as impressive as Time Magazine, so all we have is the quote itself.
“Quoting from fairly recent publications: “The __________ church conference today approved recommendation that homosexuality between consenting adults should no longer be a criminal offense. …”
The voice from a much-read magazine: “… a group of __________ ministers in San Francisco thinks the churches ought to drop their strictures against homosexuals. …”
It was reported that groups of ministers and their wives attended a party given by homosexuals and lesbians to raise funds for the perversion program. The magazine quoted: “… that all Bay area schools would have to close down immediately if all homosexuals currently working in the school systems were discovered and in keeping with state law, dismissed.” (Newsweek, February 13, 1967.)
The minister quoted is reported to have said: “… two people of the same sex can express love and deepen that love by sexual intercourse.” (Ibid.)”
Ouch. Historically, quote notation-wise and word-wise, ouch.
It’s better to read such things in context – if you felt triggered by this, I would encourage you to read the full talk for context. There’s more there than just the quote there.
It is what it is. President Kimball wasn’t wrong, but it could have been worded better, more like it’s worded today, now that we know more about the nature of homosexuality than we did in the 70s.
There are obvious differences between the Church’s doctrine and the beliefs and practices of the LBGTQ community. We live in a free country, where we’ve come to the point where some churches and the gay community live in an uneasy peace, and probably will going forward.
We in our church would have everyone want to serve the Lord. Not everyone will, and that’s our challenge – to learn to love those who want different things than us. It’s never easy to do. The LBGTQ community would have everyone accept them for who they are, who they love, and what they do. Not everyone can, and that can’t be easy to sit with either.
Forcing people to believe what they don’t only creates an underground that becomes a volcano – something that Christians AND gay people have both demonstrated at different times in history.
How do we fix a problem of this magnitude?
Like I know.
I have no idea, other than to accept what is and try to see each other as children of God, individuals, and not arbitrary labels. Christ never did. That’s all I know.
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